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	<title>Comments on: 10 Click Track Myths</title>
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		<title>By: Matt H</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1634</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt H</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Oct 2008 18:45:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1634</guid>
		<description>A click track is great if you are overdubbing.  It is unnatural and unnecessary for live recordings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A click track is great if you are overdubbing.  It is unnatural and unnecessary for live recordings.</p>
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		<title>By: Skillet</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1622</link>
		<dc:creator>Skillet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2008 18:56:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1622</guid>
		<description>I think that a lot of the stuff brought up in this section have been pretty spot on. I&#039;m yet another drummer commenting on this section. I prefer to work with a click, so I don&#039;t have to worry about things speeding up or slowing down. I&#039;m a decent drummer, and I get calls to do studio work fairly regularly. I think that when you are playing in a situation where the band is recording live it can become a problem if the band, or even one member doesn&#039;t have a good sense of time. When I&#039;m playing live, I&#039;m always listening to hear what&#039;s going on around me, and adjusting to what I perceive as adjustments that have to be made in the time.

I&#039;ve played in a lot of live sequenced situations, but in those cases there is a lot more information than just a cowbell, or some beeping going on. I&#039;ve found that it&#039;s the space in between the notes that cause people the most problems. 

A good compromise in a lot of cases with less experienced players is to use a little drum machine or the software to create a loop that can guide them through the track. it becomes more a part of the song than just an annoying pulse in your ear.

I&#039;ve seen stuff on records change tempo, and it works. those are some really good performances, and some not so good ones. Tracy Chapman&#039;s Give me one reason, has a increase in the tempo by a couple of beats per minute after the second chorus, which gives the song a nice lift and a bit more urgency. 

I think that it&#039;s something that everyone should be able to do, but not something that always has to happen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that a lot of the stuff brought up in this section have been pretty spot on. I&#8217;m yet another drummer commenting on this section. I prefer to work with a click, so I don&#8217;t have to worry about things speeding up or slowing down. I&#8217;m a decent drummer, and I get calls to do studio work fairly regularly. I think that when you are playing in a situation where the band is recording live it can become a problem if the band, or even one member doesn&#8217;t have a good sense of time. When I&#8217;m playing live, I&#8217;m always listening to hear what&#8217;s going on around me, and adjusting to what I perceive as adjustments that have to be made in the time.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve played in a lot of live sequenced situations, but in those cases there is a lot more information than just a cowbell, or some beeping going on. I&#8217;ve found that it&#8217;s the space in between the notes that cause people the most problems. </p>
<p>A good compromise in a lot of cases with less experienced players is to use a little drum machine or the software to create a loop that can guide them through the track. it becomes more a part of the song than just an annoying pulse in your ear.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve seen stuff on records change tempo, and it works. those are some really good performances, and some not so good ones. Tracy Chapman&#8217;s Give me one reason, has a increase in the tempo by a couple of beats per minute after the second chorus, which gives the song a nice lift and a bit more urgency. </p>
<p>I think that it&#8217;s something that everyone should be able to do, but not something that always has to happen.</p>
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		<title>By: Bryan Tewell</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1513</link>
		<dc:creator>Bryan Tewell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:46:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1513</guid>
		<description>Being as I&#039;m a drummer who has been playing with clicks for about 6 or 7 years (which is most of my time as a drummer) I figure maybe my personal opinions on click tracks may be of some value and might help people who have trouble playing with them.

First, click tracks can be absolutely annoying. The key is to find a sound that has a very clean attack but doesn&#039;t sound annoying. A hi-hat sound might be a good one. I use Digital Performer, which comes with something like... 10 click tones. I find that the UREI click is painful and probably the quickest way to develop tinnitus. The studio at my school has a real UREI click machine and its even worse. In DP I use one of the cowbell sounds. Its not my favorite but its a compromise between hearing loss and being able to hear the click easily. My favorite click sound that I&#039;ve used to date is on the Boss DB90 metronome. I was going to sample it into DP but then I killed it.

Second, For someone starting out using a click track, its probably easier to have the click track much louder than everything else in the headphones or just obviously loud if nothing else is in the phones. Its much harder to get off the beat of the click track when its the main thing you can hear. It grabs your focus much more(might be bad if you have A.D.D. haha.) I find that now, I can play with the click track barely heard because I&#039;m so used to it being there that I can keep it more in my subconscious and still stay with it.

Lastly, Click tracks do not have to stiffen up the groove. This all depends on the drummer. I find that now I can play on top of and behind the click track and still stay with it. In this way the click is liberating to me as a drummer because I can lay back on a beat without fear of dragging the song. Also, if the rest of the band feels like a certain part of a song is slower than it should be because we&#039;re using a click, I can play more in front of the beat and please the band a little bit without fear of it turning into rushing. Obviously I haven&#039;t always been able to do this, but it came over time. The bottom line is that every drummer, if they want to have a job with playing the drums, needs to not only be comfortable with the click track but be very good at playing with one, because its just how 99% of songs are recorded these days.

One last piece of information. Don&#039;t let the click track become a crutch. I have found that when not using a click I speed up like Jeff Gordon on stuff when I go on tempo autopilot, which I do when I&#039;m playing with a click. Just remember when you aren&#039;t playing with a click that you once again have to pay attention to not speeding up/slowing down.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Being as I&#8217;m a drummer who has been playing with clicks for about 6 or 7 years (which is most of my time as a drummer) I figure maybe my personal opinions on click tracks may be of some value and might help people who have trouble playing with them.</p>
<p>First, click tracks can be absolutely annoying. The key is to find a sound that has a very clean attack but doesn&#8217;t sound annoying. A hi-hat sound might be a good one. I use Digital Performer, which comes with something like&#8230; 10 click tones. I find that the UREI click is painful and probably the quickest way to develop tinnitus. The studio at my school has a real UREI click machine and its even worse. In DP I use one of the cowbell sounds. Its not my favorite but its a compromise between hearing loss and being able to hear the click easily. My favorite click sound that I&#8217;ve used to date is on the Boss DB90 metronome. I was going to sample it into DP but then I killed it.</p>
<p>Second, For someone starting out using a click track, its probably easier to have the click track much louder than everything else in the headphones or just obviously loud if nothing else is in the phones. Its much harder to get off the beat of the click track when its the main thing you can hear. It grabs your focus much more(might be bad if you have A.D.D. haha.) I find that now, I can play with the click track barely heard because I&#8217;m so used to it being there that I can keep it more in my subconscious and still stay with it.</p>
<p>Lastly, Click tracks do not have to stiffen up the groove. This all depends on the drummer. I find that now I can play on top of and behind the click track and still stay with it. In this way the click is liberating to me as a drummer because I can lay back on a beat without fear of dragging the song. Also, if the rest of the band feels like a certain part of a song is slower than it should be because we&#8217;re using a click, I can play more in front of the beat and please the band a little bit without fear of it turning into rushing. Obviously I haven&#8217;t always been able to do this, but it came over time. The bottom line is that every drummer, if they want to have a job with playing the drums, needs to not only be comfortable with the click track but be very good at playing with one, because its just how 99% of songs are recorded these days.</p>
<p>One last piece of information. Don&#8217;t let the click track become a crutch. I have found that when not using a click I speed up like Jeff Gordon on stuff when I go on tempo autopilot, which I do when I&#8217;m playing with a click. Just remember when you aren&#8217;t playing with a click that you once again have to pay attention to not speeding up/slowing down.</p>
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		<title>By: banjobkp</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1495</link>
		<dc:creator>banjobkp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:02:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1495</guid>
		<description>This was one of the best pieces I&#039;ve seen generated on this site...

Thank you!

What is important is to recognize that tools, and there are many, are often situational. 

I used to believe that every good recording used a click, until I did a demo in a studio where the engineer convinced me that the click could be stultifying. And for the purposes of the recording we did, he was correct. Fortunately i was in a band that was prepared and talented enough to go without, and the recording had a nice spark, as we did all the rhythm tracks as a band. 

I have actually used this method myself as a preferred way to generate lively tracks. To get a &quot;band&quot; sound, you have to record the band playing. Overdubs can still be done, but they can be challenging and they can stick out as a dub, but it all depends what one wants in a recording.

My next project, I believe we are going back to the click track, as I believe I will be living in a heavily overdubbed project. Essentially, I&#039;m following your recommendation. I want my next recording to be executed better, so while I&#039;m going to still record the rhythm tracks as a session, I&#039;m going to have the click available for the overdubs. I&#039;m just going to have to take the time for the band to get used to the click in a recording session. Since we are going to do it ourselves on computer, we&#039;ll just keep at it until its right.

Thank you for this information and perspective. It does simply confirm, that there are no absolutes in music or recording it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This was one of the best pieces I&#8217;ve seen generated on this site&#8230;</p>
<p>Thank you!</p>
<p>What is important is to recognize that tools, and there are many, are often situational. </p>
<p>I used to believe that every good recording used a click, until I did a demo in a studio where the engineer convinced me that the click could be stultifying. And for the purposes of the recording we did, he was correct. Fortunately i was in a band that was prepared and talented enough to go without, and the recording had a nice spark, as we did all the rhythm tracks as a band. </p>
<p>I have actually used this method myself as a preferred way to generate lively tracks. To get a &#8220;band&#8221; sound, you have to record the band playing. Overdubs can still be done, but they can be challenging and they can stick out as a dub, but it all depends what one wants in a recording.</p>
<p>My next project, I believe we are going back to the click track, as I believe I will be living in a heavily overdubbed project. Essentially, I&#8217;m following your recommendation. I want my next recording to be executed better, so while I&#8217;m going to still record the rhythm tracks as a session, I&#8217;m going to have the click available for the overdubs. I&#8217;m just going to have to take the time for the band to get used to the click in a recording session. Since we are going to do it ourselves on computer, we&#8217;ll just keep at it until its right.</p>
<p>Thank you for this information and perspective. It does simply confirm, that there are no absolutes in music or recording it.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Low</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1479</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Low</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Aug 2008 04:07:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1479</guid>
		<description>The click track is IMO always needed to lay the foundation for a track other people will be adding to, especially if the drum part has long rests in it.  

I often make the click track a combination of tones, like cowbell on the down beat and clave on the up-beat.  Sometimes I even add click track notes in between the 8th notes for better cueing.  With a straight quarter not click, if a loud drummer hears the click, he or she is already off from it because his/her drum hits would be louder than the click unless it&#039;s turned up loud enough to damage his/her hearing.  You need something between the beats so he/she can lock in without having to listen to a cowbell banging in his/her phones louder than the drum he/she is slamming.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The click track is IMO always needed to lay the foundation for a track other people will be adding to, especially if the drum part has long rests in it.  </p>
<p>I often make the click track a combination of tones, like cowbell on the down beat and clave on the up-beat.  Sometimes I even add click track notes in between the 8th notes for better cueing.  With a straight quarter not click, if a loud drummer hears the click, he or she is already off from it because his/her drum hits would be louder than the click unless it&#8217;s turned up loud enough to damage his/her hearing.  You need something between the beats so he/she can lock in without having to listen to a cowbell banging in his/her phones louder than the drum he/she is slamming.</p>
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		<title>By: Alexander Dorian</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1472</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexander Dorian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 20:52:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1472</guid>
		<description>I usually ditch the click with young bands too, maybe we use for that elusive part that Brandon mentioned where there is a transition with a punch in. It is really not that hard to program it in later or just go in and record a cowbell (more cowbell!) part via the vocalist mic on the fly.

Usually most young bands don&#039;t have that good of a sense of playing to click as their drummers are usually inexperienced and have never done it. On the other hand - they are also not that good at keeping rhythm. It is still easier to edit several takes together for the best performance rather than quantize to a grid.

On the other hand - we just did a song for my band that was on a click, then we got a drummer to track remotely and send us the performance. He was a pro so he was able to play around the click. Granted - we had to do a few edits and retrack a few guitar parts to fit the drums better in feel but if there was no click this would&#039;ve been a mess to do in the first place. Now - we have a song done via correspondence drumming and it sound pretty good!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I usually ditch the click with young bands too, maybe we use for that elusive part that Brandon mentioned where there is a transition with a punch in. It is really not that hard to program it in later or just go in and record a cowbell (more cowbell!) part via the vocalist mic on the fly.</p>
<p>Usually most young bands don&#8217;t have that good of a sense of playing to click as their drummers are usually inexperienced and have never done it. On the other hand &#8211; they are also not that good at keeping rhythm. It is still easier to edit several takes together for the best performance rather than quantize to a grid.</p>
<p>On the other hand &#8211; we just did a song for my band that was on a click, then we got a drummer to track remotely and send us the performance. He was a pro so he was able to play around the click. Granted &#8211; we had to do a few edits and retrack a few guitar parts to fit the drums better in feel but if there was no click this would&#8217;ve been a mess to do in the first place. Now &#8211; we have a song done via correspondence drumming and it sound pretty good!</p>
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		<title>By: Johnnywaud</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1469</link>
		<dc:creator>Johnnywaud</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 15:28:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1469</guid>
		<description>in reply to the comments about telling the band they are great when they arent, I agree that it doesn&#039;t do them any good.  Band who come in need to learn the process to progress.  I don&#039;t strongarm anyone into doing things my way unless I am the producer and my name HAS to be on it.  I have never lost a client because I told them what needs to be improved on to make thier recordings better.  Most first time bands have an inflated idea of &quot;studio magic&quot; and &quot;fix it in the mix.&quot;  When there are problems from not being able to play to a click and they ask why thing turned out the way they did, and tell me thier friend fixed it in his basement studio when they recorded, I must always rebutt with &quot;I can fix it but that takes time, and time takes money and you have alredy told me that this is all you have to spend.&quot;  I alsays give deals and push the time for people who are paying cash and don&#039;t have a deal.  I cannot however be taken advantage of and give away 2 days of editting time for free.  Correcting tempo can be done via time compression and expansion, beat correction, and copying and pasting of parst,  but it takes amny many hours to do it.  its easier to get the band to play it better in the first place. A band looksfor direction when they come into the studio for the first time(if they have no producer) and if you don&#039;t hold thier hand, the demo never gets finished.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>in reply to the comments about telling the band they are great when they arent, I agree that it doesn&#8217;t do them any good.  Band who come in need to learn the process to progress.  I don&#8217;t strongarm anyone into doing things my way unless I am the producer and my name HAS to be on it.  I have never lost a client because I told them what needs to be improved on to make thier recordings better.  Most first time bands have an inflated idea of &#8220;studio magic&#8221; and &#8220;fix it in the mix.&#8221;  When there are problems from not being able to play to a click and they ask why thing turned out the way they did, and tell me thier friend fixed it in his basement studio when they recorded, I must always rebutt with &#8220;I can fix it but that takes time, and time takes money and you have alredy told me that this is all you have to spend.&#8221;  I alsays give deals and push the time for people who are paying cash and don&#8217;t have a deal.  I cannot however be taken advantage of and give away 2 days of editting time for free.  Correcting tempo can be done via time compression and expansion, beat correction, and copying and pasting of parst,  but it takes amny many hours to do it.  its easier to get the band to play it better in the first place. A band looksfor direction when they come into the studio for the first time(if they have no producer) and if you don&#8217;t hold thier hand, the demo never gets finished.</p>
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		<title>By: brandondrury</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1468</link>
		<dc:creator>brandondrury</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 14:49:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1468</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;You’ll only end up spending hours (of their money) working against their natural level of ability.. and they’ll get frustrated, and you’lll have lost a future return client.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
You don&#039;t lose clients because of click tracks.  You lose clients when you fail to deliver the quality of recording they expect.

Without a doubt, my personality has had a stronger effect on return clients than my actual recording ability (especially in the beginning of my recording quest).

I don&#039;t believe in telling people what they want to hear.  This is dishonest and it limits the progress of the band.  When a band is young and inexperienced we make the best recording we can.  If I want the click, but the click is causing problems, we ditch the click.  HOWEVER, I make it abundantly clear that it is my opinion that the band needs to work on this, this, and this to make our next recording better.

I don&#039;t insult the bands and I certainly don&#039;t force anything upon them.  However, I am always honest and up front with ways in which they can improve.  It&#039;s VERY exciting when they do come back in 6 - 18 months and they have improved.  I&#039;ve seen it numerous times and it&#039;s one of the better feelings in the world.

If I took the politician approach and told them they are awesome when I was clearly not telling the truth, I think people would lose all respect for me.  

Brandon</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>You’ll only end up spending hours (of their money) working against their natural level of ability.. and they’ll get frustrated, and you’lll have lost a future return client.</p></blockquote>
<p>You don&#8217;t lose clients because of click tracks.  You lose clients when you fail to deliver the quality of recording they expect.</p>
<p>Without a doubt, my personality has had a stronger effect on return clients than my actual recording ability (especially in the beginning of my recording quest).</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t believe in telling people what they want to hear.  This is dishonest and it limits the progress of the band.  When a band is young and inexperienced we make the best recording we can.  If I want the click, but the click is causing problems, we ditch the click.  HOWEVER, I make it abundantly clear that it is my opinion that the band needs to work on this, this, and this to make our next recording better.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t insult the bands and I certainly don&#8217;t force anything upon them.  However, I am always honest and up front with ways in which they can improve.  It&#8217;s VERY exciting when they do come back in 6 &#8211; 18 months and they have improved.  I&#8217;ve seen it numerous times and it&#8217;s one of the better feelings in the world.</p>
<p>If I took the politician approach and told them they are awesome when I was clearly not telling the truth, I think people would lose all respect for me.  </p>
<p>Brandon</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Kent</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1466</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Kent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 08:34:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1466</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s quite a few new bands that will want to record a first demo but are highly under prepared for time in the studio. Not only that, they are not very good at keeping time...

For young blossoming bands, it&#039;s as important for them to have a &quot;fun&quot; time and get a boost.. as it is for you to do some fancy production on their track. In which case, don&#039;t even bother with a click track. You&#039;ll only end up spending hours (of their money) working against their natural level of ability.. and they&#039;ll get frustrated, and you&#039;lll have lost a future return client.

Much better to finish the session with a smile.. deliver something half decent. Then tell them they did great... but if they wanted to improve..... (BIG list of things..)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s quite a few new bands that will want to record a first demo but are highly under prepared for time in the studio. Not only that, they are not very good at keeping time&#8230;</p>
<p>For young blossoming bands, it&#8217;s as important for them to have a &#8220;fun&#8221; time and get a boost.. as it is for you to do some fancy production on their track. In which case, don&#8217;t even bother with a click track. You&#8217;ll only end up spending hours (of their money) working against their natural level of ability.. and they&#8217;ll get frustrated, and you&#8217;lll have lost a future return client.</p>
<p>Much better to finish the session with a smile.. deliver something half decent. Then tell them they did great&#8230; but if they wanted to improve&#8230;.. (BIG list of things..)</p>
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		<title>By: Phil Dalmolin</title>
		<link>http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/drum-recording/10-click-track-myths/comment-page-1/#comment-1465</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil Dalmolin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 06:36:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.recordingreview.com/blog/?p=108#comment-1465</guid>
		<description>I love click.  I encourage it completely when guys can play to it.  Just because a drummer pushes a crash a millimeter on the the grid or lays something back behind the grid just a tad, doesn&#039;t mean he can&#039;t play.  Call me an ass-kisser, but brandon is EXACTLY right with this article.  That comes from playing with click for over 20 years.  I got my first Boss dr. beat in 1985.  It taught me to play....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love click.  I encourage it completely when guys can play to it.  Just because a drummer pushes a crash a millimeter on the the grid or lays something back behind the grid just a tad, doesn&#8217;t mean he can&#8217;t play.  Call me an ass-kisser, but brandon is EXACTLY right with this article.  That comes from playing with click for over 20 years.  I got my first Boss dr. beat in 1985.  It taught me to play&#8230;.</p>
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